Peggy Olson's Just Not In The Beatles


On Wednesday night we watched the mid-season finale of Mad Men together, over the phone, in an international teleconference we named Moonlandingcon. Here's a transcript of our conversation, which is pretty steadily focused on kissing, hotness, Peggy Olson, and the Beatles.

LIZ: Are you sad that Bert died? 

LJ: I mean, I could be sadder. Like, I'll live. Are you sad that Bert died? Wait, I don't care anymore, Ted Chaough's on.

LIZ: He looks so good right there.

LJ: I know! I just love him so much, he's so perfect. What a cool move.

LIZ: Yeah. I kind of wish they'd shown him unraveling more.

LJ: Yeah, I know. But I feel like they allude to it. There was that time that Harry Crane was like, "Ted Chaough is useless-"


LJ: Oh, Harry.

LIZ: He looks really good there too. I like a man in a button-down shirt-sleeve shirt.

LJ: Yeah. I like how he has a little vial of orange juice. 

LIZ: I didn't even notice that. Oh, because of Sunkist!

LJ: Oh yeah, that's true.

LIZ: I'm glad Lou Avery's gone.

LJ: Yeah, he was a waste of everyone's time. I mean it was nice having someone that overtly antagonistic be on the show, but I just can't stand his underbite. You know that scene when Ginsberg is watching Jim Cutler and Lou Avery in the IBM computer room and there's no sound? I feel like you can see Lou Avery's soft gumminess. It was disgusting.

LIZ: I like that you Internet-researched him.

LJ: It really paid off.

LIZ: I don't like that boy.

LJ: The hot boy? Yeah I don't like this Sally plotline to be honest.

LIZ: It's kind of a letdown after a lot of Sally buildup.

LJ: I just want Sally to do exactly what I would do in every situation. I feel sort of abandoned by her when she doesn't. She's just so lame and like a normal person in this episode. She's really Betty, I guess. 

LJ: What do you think of this guy?

LIZ: I don't like his mouth. He has a strange mouth. Like a dumb mouth. 

LJ: He kind of looks like the old Bobby Draper.

LIZ: I wish he was the old Bobby Draper!

LJ: I wish they would just cast that Bobby Draper as Julio.

LJ: I feel like I would like that guy if he appeared in my life. He's not that hot on TV but if he just walked into my restaurant I'd be like "You're superhot and Michael Showalter-y." 

LIZ: Oh, the fried eggs!

LJ: Yeah, the fried eggs are my favorite. Mark and I watched this episode at my dad's house and when the fried eggs came onto the screen he was like "Ugh." I feel like my dad is sometimes grossed out about weird cool things from Mad Men because he lived them. Like, "I remember when plates of fried eggs were served to me."

LIZ: I don't like Sally's hair like that.

LJ: Yeah, I feel like this scene ruined so many years of loving Sally Draper for me.

LIZ: But that walk is really cute that she does right there.

LJ: I like Betty.

LIZ: Me too, man.

LJ: Betty's great.

LIZ: Oh, Stan! I wanna see Stan's girlfriend.

LJ: I feel like she's probably amazing. Just such a chill lady. Probably smart with cool opinions on things and she makes Stan laugh. Imagine Stan laughing at something hilarious you said if he was in love with you? That would be the best feeling in the world!

LJ: Eww, Meredith. I don't know. I like Meredith. I'm happy she's on the show.

LIZ: Yeah she gives us some comedy. I like how proud of herself she is for getting to hang out with Don.

LJ: She walks out of the situation like, "You killed that, Meredith. You were so sexy and classy."

LJ: Joan's dress is one of my favorite Joan looks.

LIZ: I like how Ken isn't really involved in this scene but he comes out just so we can have a look at him. 

LJ: They never addressed my question about what the deal with his eye is. He seems surprisingly chill about his own eye issue. I feel like if something really bad happened to my eye and I had to wear an eye patch, I wouldn't just be like at the office, smiling and checking in with the partners. I'd quit my job and just be depressed about my eye.

LIZ: But Ken just rolls with the punches.

LJ: What do you think his zodiac sign is?

LIZ: Maybe a Taurus? Maybe a Leo?

LJ: Maybe a Sag? He could be a best-case scenario Sag. I feel like Ted Chaough is Pisces.

LIZ: What's Don's sign?

LJ: I feel like he's a Gemini. I feel like it comes up that his birthday's in early June.

LIZ: I feel cheated that Joan voted against Don. Although I kind of see her point 'cause she was mad at him about Jaguar. 

LJ: Yeah, Jaguar just didn't really play a great role in Joan's life. 

LIZ: But now she's gonna be a millionaire.

LJ: I don't want any of them to be millionaires. I want to relate to them. I just want them all to be in the exact same financial place as I am.

LJ: Mad Style made the point that Julio is around the age that Peggy's son would be and so that explains her weird fondness for him. I think that's really sweet.

LIZ: Whoa, I can't believe it was that long ago.

LJ: Yeah, but it was, it was nine years ago or maybe eight.

LIZ: I like Peggy's housecoat.

LJ: Yeah. She has pretty good eyebrows. I love her, I just wanna be her best friend forever. Do you think she would like us?

LIZ: I do.

LJ: Yeah, she's kind of like Kit Jones [the character played by Jen May in the Wes Anderson-directed feature film Blurred Lines, which we conceptualized while on Martha's Vineyard last summer].

LIZ: She is like Kit Jones.

LJ: And I guess Tippi's kind of a Joan.

LIZ: Yeah, she's like Airhead Joan.

LJ: She's like Meredith meets Joan. And then Nan is that Jewish entrepreneur

LJ: Do you feel like you relate to Megan because she's in L.A.?

LIZ: No, but I like that she's drinking white wine in the middle of the day in a bikini.

LJ: Yeah. Shout out to white wine.

LIZ: And she has a telescope, which I just noticed. 

LJ: Yeah, I read that somewhere that she has a telescope. Why does she have a telescope?

LIZ: I feel like she doesn't actually use it.

LJ: No, she certainly does not use it. What do you think Megan's zodiac sign is?

LIZ: Libra?

LJ: Yeah. She could be a Scorpio.

LIZ: Yeah but that undermines all the Scorpios who I love, I feel.

LJ: Yeah, but crappy people have to have cool zodiac signs sometimes. Oh, wait, I just figured it out - she's an Aquarius. I feel like one percent of people are Aquarius, and Megan is one of those people.

LJ: I don't understand how Don feels about Megan.

LIZ: I don't wanna understand. 

LJ: Yeah, that's true. That's just Don's shit.

LIZ: It's definitely the least interesting part of Don. 

LJ: I feel like Don having some kind of romantic thing with Peggy would sort of be his apology to me for Megan. I just need Don to be with someone smart and interesting. Besides Dr. Fay.

LIZ: We deserve better than Dr. Fay. 

LIZ: I like how Peggy's always smoking now.

LJ: I like how it's her secret thing though. I feel like she just goes into her office and smokes a cigarette really fast and then is like, "I didn't do that." 

LIZ: But it seems like she's smoking more publicly lately.

LJ: Pete's so proud of himself for saying that sentence. He's like, "Good one, Pete. 'The Don Draper Show is back,' that's so smart. That was a good point."

LIZ: Wait, you're not a Pete fan, right?

LJ: I'm definitely not a Pete fan like you're a Pete fan. I would say that I'm a Pete fan in that I'm a fan of Pete being a character on Mad Men. I like him better than usual right now. I don't relate to Pete at all, and I definitely need to relate to people to like them. But yeah, Pete's great. I like watching him do things. I really liked when you made the point about how you hate when Pete suffers any indignity. 

LIZ: Yeah, I really do hate it. I feel so embarrassed for him.

LIZ: Ellery's really creepy. Also their food looks really good, and I didn't realize until the episode was over that Mona and Roger were hanging out. 

LJ: What do you mean?

LIZ: I forget they weren't married anymore and that it was weird for them to be together.

LJ: But I feel like they're kinda into each other right now. Their old spark has been rekindled.  God, Mona looks so hot.

LIZ: She has the same hair as Sally but it looks so much better on her.

LJ: I wish Sally could hang out with Mona for a bit. I feel like that's exactly what Sally needs.

LJ: Look how their shoulders are touching. They're in love! The sparks are flying. You don't do that when you're not into someone, I'm sorry. 

LJ: I thought Margaret had died.

LIZ: I feel like Roger would have had a stronger reaction if his daughter was dead.

LJ: Yeah. Like, "Oh shit - my daughter just died."

LJ: I like that he went to office alone to give himself that moment. 

LIZ: He's a softie.

LJ: God, Roger and Joan should just kiss. I want everyone to kiss on Mad Men constantly. I'm always hoping. Eww, look at Jim Cutler's day-off outfit. I feel like he's too thin.

LIZ: Oh, Jim.

LIZ & LJ: You're the worst.

LJ: This is my least favorite scene of the episode.

LIZ: Do you think she kissed him because she knew she wasn't going to get to kiss the other boy, or because she genuinely wanted to?

LJ: I think it was because she wasn't going to get to kiss the other boy. But when Mark and I were on the streetcar home, we asked each other what was our favorite and least favorite part and I said this was my least favorite. And he was like, "Oh, really? I just sort of empathize with any nerd character in any show." It was sweet. I'm happy my boyfriend automatically had this weird minor character on Mad Men's back. 

LIZ: That boy's cute, though.

LJ: Yeah, but I just feel like Sally's just being kind of an idiot. I don't know. I also just feel like she's not that old. Kiernan Shipka's like 14 but I feel like she's being like 16 now.

LIZ: I like her smoking look. She's so impressed with herself.

LJ: I just feel like she needs more time before having these sorts of storylines.

LIZ: But we don't have time.

LJ: That's true. Just get it in, Mad Men! Have Sally blossom into womanhood.

LIZ: I love that line - "Now I'm gonna lose you too!"

LJ: Roger's so vulnerable. 

LIZ: I'm glad that everyone likes each other again now. I get really stressed out when they don't like each other.

LJ: Don's definitely the alpha of the situation. Once someone agrees to like Don again, they all like Don.

LIZ: She looks so good and she's so happy he's coming to see her. I wish she would just wear her hair like that.

LJ: I feel like Don is so handsome that how could Peggy not be in love with him? How could you have a person that handsome be in your life?

LIZ: I feel like she's a little bit in love with him always.

LJ: I feel like she thinks he's really cool. And she's really conscious of the fact that she's so much less cool. 

LIZ: Pete's pregnant!

LJ: What does he mean? Was that like being "Pete's on his period"?

LIZ: I thought it was like BurgerChef's his baby that he's about to give birth to. 

LJ: Oh. That's such a weird saying. 

LIZ: You know that one where it's a flashback to when Roger meets Don in the fur shop and Don's so smiley and eager to please? I wish we had seen some of how he went from being like that to how he is now.

LJ: Yeah. I wish there were a Mad Men channel that was just on 24 hours, seven days a week, that started at the moment Bert Cooper was born and just kept going in real time forever.

LJ: Peggy's so weird. I think what's good about this scene is she put her own unique spin on the Don Draper presentation, but she's still so weird the whole time. She's so clearly not a normal person.

LIZ: It's so weird how we love this so much that we're watching someone give a presentation about hamburgers and it's fascinating.

LJ: Yeah, everything that happens on Mad Men is insanely boring. The most exciting thing that ever happens is like, "There's a merger." I've spent my whole life going so far out of my way to avoid ever having to deal with that kind of shit. And with Mad Men it's just like, "Yes, give it to me. Like, 'Ooh - a public offering!'" 

LJ: Remember when we did "If Mad Men Were Beatles"? I feel like Peggy did not end up being George Harrison. I feel like she's Yoko kind of.

LIZ: That's true. Wait, Roger was Neil Aspinall, wasn't he? And Pete was Paul McCartney. Who was Ringo? Oh, it was Ken Cosgrove.

LJ: Oh, that's nice. Yeah, so happy about his eye patch.

LIZ: Do you remember who Joan was?

LJ: Yeah, George Martin. I really like that. I feel like that really honors Joan in all her glory. I feel like even George Martin would be like, "Yes, that's true. I am Joan."

LIZ: The back of Pete's hair is so weird there. And he looks kind of fat.

LJ: I like how Roger's office is such an insane hodgepodge of weird psychedelic shit. But he's still so Roger. He looks like a square business-y guy.

LJ: Pete's so cool. I feel like this is my favorite Pete ever, Pete in this office right now. 

LIZ: I just noticed Ted's boots.

LJ: Ted had those boots last season. Ted's so fly. Ted's a true creative. Maybe Ted's the real George of the situation.

LIZ: Yeah, he is. Paul's calling him selfish.

LJ: Yeah, and now he looks all sad. Classic. Classic. And then John [Don] is appealing to George, like, "We're both honest and creative. We're in it for the art."

LIZ: Did you like this?

LJ: At first I didn't. I really thought it was stupid and wished it wasn't happening. But then once I found out it was an homage to Robert Morse I didn't really care. I think it's cool how they just put that into the show. I think it's sweet. But I also feel bad for Robert Morse, I feel like it's like, "You're off the show and you're probably gonna die in like four years."

LJ: All in all, great show. I wish we could have the whole seventh season now.

LIZ: But I would be so sad if it were gonna be over in seven weeks, so I'd rather it be over in a year.

LJ: I know, but I'm afraid of dying and then never getting to see the end of Mad Men.

LIZ: Yeah, that's true. Same.

LJ: But I do like how I started watching Mad Men when I was 23 and it's gonna end right before I turn 30. I feel like Mad Men's thing was being the decade of the '60s but it was also my decade of being in my 20s. Then I'll just turn 30 and it'll be like "Welcome to my new cold hard life of being 30 and having there be no Mad Men ever again."

LIZ: I feel like there'll be nothing I'll ever love as much as Mad Men.

LJ: Except the Beatles.

LIZ: Yeah, but the Beatles don't produce new material.

LJ: But I feel like Mad Men is right up there with the Beatles.

LIZ: Yeah, and I never thought about that before, how they both start and end in the same timespan.

LJ: That's true. I really just want them to talk about Abbey Road. I want someone to bring it up conversationally, like "What's your favorite song on Abbey Road?" What do you think is Peggy Olson's favorite song on Abbey Road?

LIZ: I bet she likes "Something" a lot.

LJ: Yeah, that's so cute. I bet Stan loves the medley. He probably has some cool opinion about why the medley was great.

LIZ: Remember before it was season 4 and we thought it was gonna be about the Beatles all the time?

LJ: Yeah, they really didn't make it that Beatlesy. But I guess the times they did I appreciated it. I mean, obviously - the two things I've loved most in life, counting every personal experience I've ever had. Does Paul McCartney watch Mad Men, do you think?

LIZ: I hope so.

LJ: He obviously has to. He doesn't just not watch Mad Men. Why wouldn't he? I mean, maybe he doesn't have time.

LIZ: He must, though. An hour a week? He must have a free hour a week.

LJ: I bet he thinks Peggy is Paul. He's like, "She's so lovely and intelligent." But I mean, she's not Paul. Peggy Olson's just not in the Beatles.


  1. In terms of astrology, this is what I found:

    Don (Dick Whitman, actually): Sagittarius
    Betty: Cancer
    Peggy: Gemini
    Joan: Pisces

    1. Ooooohhhh I love Betty as a Cancer! I also just found out that Sally was born in April 1954- she's a total Aries.


  2. Haha, I'm an Aries, too. :)